Minutes:
The Chair stated that two
members of the public wished to speak on this item. Mr Murray James
read his statement: “Grays has been offered a once in a
generation opportunity to connect the town with its Thames
foreshore through the £20m Town Fund. This could unlock huge
recreational potential on the river – potential that is also
recognised by the Port of London Authority through its Active
Thames programme which aims to increase participation in
recreational activity along the full length of the river. Our
stretch of the Thames has some unique advantages for sailing in
particular, but strong tides, deep mud, and commercial shipping
traffic mean it is a challenging area for novices. A degree of both
competence and confidence are required to enjoy our waters safely.
Grays is a coastal town with a proud maritime history and at
Thurrock Yacht Club we firmly believe that we need to be putting a
focus on maritime sports in an area that suffers from high levels
of inactivity – a problem that members will know leads to a
higher long term demand on scarce council and NHS resources.
Thurrock is fortunate in that it already has a fantastic facility
at Grangewaters. Following the winding down of sailing at Stubbers
in Upminster, Grangewaters is now the only safe learning water
within easy reach of Thurrock. It is also ideal as a feeder site
for other aquatic sports that can transfer to the Thames including
paddle sports and rowing. Our club is currently working with the
team at Grangewaters to establish regular recreational sailing
activities that span both their site and our established sailing
area on the Grays waterfront. A joined up offer of this nature
creates opportunity not only for the people of Thurrock – it
will attract people to come from surrounding areas to regularly
enjoy leisure time in our wonderful borough and prove that we are
more than just a place to shop. We urge this committee to do
everything within their remit to ensure the full long term
financial impacts of disposing of Grangewaters are fully explored
before any decisions are made, including its important role in
ensuring the Grays Town fund project does not leave Thurrock
stranded with a new generation of unproductive public assets.
Grangewaters is more than a cherished community asset – it is
a vital enabler for bringing recreation to the Thames.”
The Chair thanked Mr James for his statement and asked if
Grangewaters was listed as an Asset of Community Value. She also
asked how many members Thurrock Yacht Club currently had. Mr James
replied that Grangewaters was listed as an Asset of Community
Value. He explained that membership of the Yacht Club had been
growing rapidly due to the closure of Stubbers in Upminster. He
stated that there were currently 130 members from across Thurrock,
Havering and Brentwood. He added that the Club had also recently
been gifted numerous dinghies to ensure that sailing and river
activities remained accessible and affordable for everyone.
Ms Samantha Byrne then read her question: “the report talks
about the importance of arts and culture. Can you please explain
how you can consider closing the Thameside Complex that houses the
theatre and museum before the elements of the new culture strategy,
details of which haven't been released, are successfully running in
its place?” The Corporate Director Resources and Place
Delivery thanked Ms Byrne for her question and stated that Cabinet
would be making the final decision in December, but her question
and comments would be included as part of the consultation with
scrutiny for Cabinet Members to consider when making their
decision. He stated that the report set out what work had already
been taking place with interested parties, and one roundtable
meeting with community representation had taken place, with another
planned for the next couple of weeks. He added that papers on the
draft Cultural Strategy would be taken to the relevant Overview and
Scrutiny Committee when completed. Ms Byrne thanked the Corporate
Director Resource and Place Delivery for his response and stated
that the roundtable meeting had taken place in September. She
explained that a second meeting had been planned, but had been
cancelled due to the tragic death of Sir David Amess MP, along with
all Council meetings in Thurrock and across Essex. She stated that
the next roundtable meeting was scheduled for the end of November
at High House Production Park, and concern was being felt amongst
residents that this would not be enough time for their feedback to
be considered by Cabinet at their meeting in December. Ms Byrne
stated that the report discussed issues with the building, not with
the service itself, and asked if income received from the Thameside
Theatre had been included in funding figures. The Corporate
Director Resources and Place Delivery replied that the service
itself would be included in the Cultural Strategy, which was still
being debated, but the building itself came under the remit of the
Corporate Overview and Scrutiny Committee. He stated that comments
made at the roundtable meeting on 30 November 2021, would be
included either within the Cabinet report, or updates would be
provided by the Portfolio Holders at the meeting verbally.
The Corporate Director Resources and Place Delivery introduced the
report and stated that it covered three areas, the first being the
Thameside Complex. He stated that the capital cost of the Thameside
Complex was £16mn, and 3.3 of the report outlined the outturn
of the Complex in 2020/21 was £601,970 and the budget in
2021/22 was £629,566, which was similar to previous years. He
stated that as the cost of utilities had increased and there had
been limited use during 2020 due to the pandemic, which had
affected the Complex’s revenue and income streams. He stated
that a breakdown had also been provided of work that needed to be
undertaken, and these figures had been produced by mechanical and
technical engineers. He added that a modernisation and
refurbishment assessment had been carried out approximately five
years ago, and these figures had been outlined in the report,
although these could have changed due to inflation and other
issues. The Corporate Director Resources and Place Delivery added
that only £300,000 had been spent on maintenance work on the
Thameside Complex within the past ten years, with only
£100,000 of this being spent within the past eight years. He
explained that the proposals would move the library and registrars
service to the Civic Offices, but the Complex would not close
before the end of March 2022, if agreed at Cabinet.
The Corporate Director Resources and Place Delivery explained that
the second area within the report was Grangewaters, which would
also be included in the December Cabinet report. He explained that
no direct plans had been agreed for the Grangewaters site, but it
had been identified for examination in July. He stated that no
immediate plans for development had been agreed, but this process
could be explored as the site would remain open for the foreseeable
future. He stated that the third area outlined in the report was
regarding libraries, which would remain open. He explained that
this was the reason why the savings target for assets had been
reduced from £1mn to £850,000.
The Chair questioned if the Thameside Complex was an Asset of
Community Value. The Corporate Director Resource and Place Delivery
explained that Grangewaters was an Asset of Community Value, which
meant that should Thurrock Council decide to dispose of the site,
the community organisation would get first refusal and a six month
decision period. He explained that an application for the Thameside
Complex to be an Asset of Community Value had been received and
returned for amendment. He explained that these amendments had now
been made and application returned. He stated that the application
would now be assessed and a decision made within the next three to
four weeks. He added that the Council had also been approached by a
community group regarding a Community Asset Transfer for the
Thameside Complex, and a meeting was scheduled for later in the
week to better understand these proposals.
Councillor Kent queried if progress had been made regarding the
sale of other assets that had been listed in the Cabinet reports in
March and July. The Corporate Director Resource and Place Delivery
responded that some assets had had no revenue costs, so had been
disposed. He explained that Thurrock Adult Community College had
already moved from the building on Richmond Road. He explained that
the site was now being demolished and asbestos being cleared,
although this would not bring any direct savings. He explained that
the additional £250,000 needed to reach the asset savings
target would mostly come from the decision not to renew the lease
with the multi-story car park. Councillor Kent stated that any
asset disposal would incur legal costs, which were not outlined in
the report. He stated that some assets also brought income into the
Council, and asked how much income would be lost from the sale of
these assets. The Corporate Director Resource and Place Delivery
responded that any legal cost from disposal would be capitalized
against future capital receipts. He added that any income generated
from the assets, including the Thameside Complex, had been included
in the budget calculations. He stated that the Thameside Theatre
had seen an income reduction of £50,000 in 2020 due to
COVID-19.
Councillor Kent stated that he was opposed to the closure of the
Thameside Complex, but felt that it did not need to be operated by
Thurrock Council. He felt that the timescales presented in the
report were tight, and felt that the Council should not work
towards making the full saving this year to allow time for
conversations with community groups and partners to conclude
satisfactorily for everyone’s needs. He felt that the
Thameside Complex did not need to be demolished as it was
structurally sound and watertight, and could be refurbished. He
added that it would be more environmentally friendly to refurbish
the building rather than demolish it, and would reduce carbon
emissions in the borough. Councillor Kent commented that if the
Thameside complex were to close, it should not do so until a new
complex had been opened. The Chair felt that the borough could have
a new theatre complex, as the current offer did not meet the need
of the community. She stated that the current theatre could not
hold larger audiences, and a new library setting could increase
engagement. The Corporate Director Resources and Place Delivery
stated that there were currently no plans in place regarding the
building and future of the site, including any plans to demolish or
renovate.
Councillor Halden welcomed the statement and questions from local
residents, and queried if the figure of £16mn was for
refurbishing or maintaining. The Corporate Director Resource and
Place Delivery replied that the majority of this figure was for
maintenances, but did include some elements of modernisation and
refurbishment. He stated that this was outlined in the table on
page 31 of the agenda, and the figure of £6.6mn for
refurbishment was based on a study completed in 2015, and could be
more or less now. Councillor Halden stated that he had recently
toured the new Civic Offices and had felt the new registrar’s
area was more spacious and private than the offer within the
Thameside Complex. He stated that theatre provision within Thurrock
should be modern and improve the cultural offer of the
borough.
Councillor Okunade felt it would be good to see the outcome of the
roundtable meeting being held on 30 November 2021, and felt the
community needed to agree with the Council on the decisions made
regarding the Thameside Complex. Ms Byrne queried the timeframe for
the £16mn spend on the Thameside Complex. The Corporate
Director Resources and Place Delivery replied that all comments
from scrutiny and residents would be included in the report to
Cabinet. He added that Councillor Coxshall and Councillor Huelin
would be attending the roundtable meeting on 30 November 2021 and
would be reporting back to Cabinet. He stated that the figures on
page 31 covered a period of ten years, but the majority of the work
would need to be carried out in the next five years, as some work
was quite urgent.
Councillor Kent moved to add a second recommendation reading:
“The Corporate Overview and Scrutiny Committee ask Cabinet to
give adequate time for conversations between community groups and
the Council to reach conclusion, even if no in-year savings can be
made.”
A vote was held, with two voting in favour of the proposed
recommendation and four voting against the recommendation. The
proposed recommendation was not agreed.
RESOLVED: That the Committee:
1. Commented on the report for consideration by Cabinet at their
meeting on 8 December 2021.
Supporting documents: